Newsflash: Men and women are different!
No matter how long the mustaches grow on the hairy-chinned feminists, they never get any wiser. Women are still being badgered to “have it all” and “do more”, even though nature trumps nurture when it comes to childbearing.
Women returning to work post-baby often care less about their job than before they gave birth, says a joint survey released last week by ForbesWoman and TheBump.com, a U.S. website for first-time parents.
The survey, which polled 2,210 women online last month, found that although 59 per cent of mothers said they were “glad to be back at work,” 59 per cent also said they “no longer cared as much” about their job.
Nor should they care as much, since raising children is a much bigger, more important responsibility than pushing papers around a desk at some made-up corporate job. Having worked in the belly of the beast, I’d say that at least a third - and that’s a very conservative estimate - of office jobs could be eliminated in a fell swoop with nobody noticing the loss. Start with the HR departments, for one. Jobs for women, about women. What a waste. The same way the washing machine made women’s work easier at home, the computer has done for men at the office - except women keep insisting on working. So jobs have to be invented. Form-filling is nice easy work - let’s have women do that!
Think I’m making that up? Read on:
While 23 per cent of the women surveyed reported having flex hours, it is still a challenge to find employers willing to tailor jobs to women’s needs. After her son was born in 2006, Sara Sutton Fell found so many telecommuting scams online that she decided to started FlexJobs.com, a job-postings site for returning moms looking for alternative work arrangements.
The Colorado woman said companies would do well to invest in work-life balance solutions for new moms to avoid high turnover and the cost of retraining: “The employers have a short-sighted view,” she said.
The employers only have one view, Sara - making money. And if you are demanding things that mess with the bottom line, someone else will come along and do your job better than you, with fewer complaints. Employers pay us to do our jobs as the employer needs them done. Unless you are some kind of award winning CEO that a company couldn’t possibly live without (think Steve Jobs - they brought that guy back from the dead when Apple stock began to tank), the company is under no obligation to accommodate you or your children.
There are plenty of part time jobs out there, ladies. But they pay part time wages.
I’m not saying women shouldn’t work. And I’m not saying women shouldn’t have children - frankly there’s no one else who can. All I’m saying is don’t buy into the feminist line that you can have babies and a gold-plated career and six orgasms before breakfast. Life is about compromises. What are you willing to trade?
@RightGirl,
Interesting take, but don’t think it goes quite far enough. As a ‘mere male’ [formerly] in the corporate world, I noticed a lot of discrepancies ‘twixt staff & distaff in the office. Women would, when came time for compensation adjustment, decry the ‘glass ceiling’. Those same women, gainfully employed as mothers, would seldom spend the extra time the job sometimes required, whereas the men had little trouble doing so. After all, if they had a family, ‘momma’ was taking care of things, no?
While I’m neither feminist nor anti-feminist, I think folk need to recognize that both XX and XY are hard-wired for certain activities; XX for nurture, support, calmness; XY for accomplishment providing, protection. There are other elements on both sides, of course, but those are the primaries. A century or so of challenge is unlikely to change millennial genetic - survival - imprinting, despite what activists might wish.
Comment by barney — March 9, 2010 @ 7:50 pm
“I’m not saying women shouldn’t work. And I’m not saying women shouldn’t have children…” Well, I’ll say it, women should not be mustached feminists!
Comment by Classicaliberal — March 9, 2010 @ 9:41 pm
CL - women would have a much better chance of being impregnated if they didn’t have beards!
RG
Comment by Right Girl — March 9, 2010 @ 9:44 pm
Unless of course you’re Sarah Palin.
Comment by ligneus — March 9, 2010 @ 10:06 pm
They invented the computer, but now women are needed to answer the phone, when there isn’t a voicemail system.
Comment by SUZANNE — March 9, 2010 @ 10:09 pm
If the choices are baby, gold plated career, and 6 orgasms before breakfast, I am 99% sure that the orgasms are the first to go. Well, at least the sex is, maybe not the orgasms.
Comment by Married Tom — March 10, 2010 @ 5:54 pm
Interesting take, but as a working woman with a flexible schedule and a 6 month old at home, I completely disagree that flexible schedules mean less productivity. Most of my co-workers, male and female, accomplish the same amount of work with a greater number of hours. I just work harder because my day is shorter. My company benefits by paying less for the same work, and I benefit by getting more time with my baby. (and it’s not menial pay or work)
Why wouldn’t it be profitable for companies to take advantage of all the highly educated, highly motivated women available? Not all jobs require 40 hours 52 weeks a year. Measuring productivity by hours in the office is archaic and inefficient.
I don’t agree with the feminists, but I also don’t agree with this article. Make it difficult for women to work when having kids and the U.S. will end up with the birth rate of Italy.
Comment by Tiffany — March 10, 2010 @ 5:58 pm
Some women can have it all. Some women can raise a family and pursue a career. Some women can win an Olympic Gold Medal- but most women have to choose, just as most men have to choose.
Comment by Pat — March 10, 2010 @ 5:59 pm
Too funny. I just had a baby in September and coming back to work was HORRIBLE. I HATED it. Truly miserable. So I quit (granted, there were other factors, but having a baby clenched it). I’m still going to work, but for a company that provides flexibility (I’ll be my own boss) and allows me to work at home with no commute unless I need to go to meetings. If working less means making less money, I’m okay with that…My son is more important to me than money. And I’m blessed with a hard working hubby too.
I ALWAYS thought that I would be a mom who worked outside the home. I was raised by a single mom and it never occurred to me that I would want to stay home. Having a baby messes with your brain. =) For me, in a good way.
Comment by megscole64 — March 10, 2010 @ 6:09 pm
“Measuring productivity by hours in the office is archaic and inefficient.”
VERY true.
There are two metrics in a job that’s tied to a location: hours you’re expected to be at the office, and work you’re expected to do. Quite often, there is very little connection between the two. People pace themselves, even unconsciously.
The whole idea of scheduling creative work like factory shifts is stupid and counterproductive. And “creative work” is more and more work in the modern world, since the computer does the boring stuff when creative people tell it how.
Comment by Barry D — March 10, 2010 @ 6:30 pm
“Start with the HR departments, for one”
Dear God, say it sister.
I deal with automating HR systems as part of my job.
If there’s one department in every corporation that’s inefficiently organized and massively confusing it’s that one.
Now in their defense they have to deal with government, so everyting is ludicrously over complicated.
Tiny example:
You’d think that most calculations would be benefit or tax X = Pay times y%, right? No, goverment stuck a max on that so X cannot exceed $Z. Sound simple? Yeah, it’s not MUCH more complicated but WHY BOTHER, but now add in 15 special cases.
The increase in corporate efficiency that would in companies just paying you a straight wage and letting you deal with pensions, unemployment insurance, tax, health insurance, and so forth is to my mind beyond belief.
And while we’re at it, repeal corporate taxation, (Thousands of very intelligent and high compensated people (tax accountants and tax lawyers)get to earn a living at *anything* other than the intellectual masturbation of messing with the tax code.)
Comment by Fred2 — March 10, 2010 @ 6:32 pm
I certainly agree that women shouldn’t expect to raise babies and have a stellar career at the same time– rare is the woman with the natural faculties to do all that. That being said, though, I think that there’s a tremendous amount of womens’ untapped productivity out there waiting to be utilized by entrepreneurs who are willing to be flexible. I think that it’s a good idea to connect such employers with moms who want a little part-time work. It’s not just moms either– a lot of disabled people have a lot to offer, but can’t hold down a traditional job because they can’t work that many hours or have days when their disability unpredictably prevents them from working.
If you’d like a glimpse into what I’m talking about, you should check out all the people selling crafts on Etsy.com. Fibromyalgia sufferers and stay-at-home moms (and some like me who are both) are over-represented there.
Comment by Wacky Hermit — March 10, 2010 @ 6:39 pm
Welcome, everyone. Good of Glenn to send y’all over here. I really feel that this is the kind of discussion that people can get their teeth into. It also happens to be the subject matter that created GOTR in the first place. My years in HR, teaching me that women are - all in all, and no offense intended - a bad investment.
RG
Comment by Right Girl — March 10, 2010 @ 6:47 pm
“[I]f you are demanding things that mess with the bottom line, someone else will come along and do your job better than you, with fewer complaints.”
Well, it used to be that you could go to the EEOC and get that problem sorted. However, these days, there’s plenty of girls out there with degrees in Communication Studies to take over that HR representative gig.
Comment by DensityDuck — March 10, 2010 @ 6:54 pm
Everyone has to read The Misandry Bubble, which Dr. Helen linked to in the past.
The costs of feminism, currently borne by men, are about to transfer back onto women.
Comment by Toads — March 10, 2010 @ 6:58 pm
The ‘pay gap’ myth is one that just has to be attacked mercilessly. It is corrosive and ignorant.
I am willing to pass laws to ensure that 50% of all Fortune 500 CEOs are women (despite the accelerated turnover this would create in the ranks of the Fortune 500), if we also legally mandate that 50% of all imprisonments are of women, and 50% of the jobs that involve working with heavy machinery, being outdoors in inclement weather, inhaling toxic fumes, or apprehending dangerous criminals are also occupied by women. Fair is fair. Any takers?
Comment by Toads — March 10, 2010 @ 7:01 pm
“And while we’re at it, repeal corporate taxation, (Thousands of very intelligent and high compensated people (tax accountants and tax lawyers)get to earn a living at *anything* other than the intellectual masturbation of messing with the tax code.)” - Fred2
First thing on my to-do list tomorrow - incorporate. Second thing: Don’t pay myself a salary. Third: Live off corporate cash in company housing and travel on the company dime. Taxes anywhere!
Meanwhile, Fred2, millions of American kids are malnourished and sick because we have no tax revenue….whatever, screw them, I’m livin’ the dream.
Comment by Chuck — March 10, 2010 @ 7:22 pm
This recession has hit my industry harder than most. (It is an administrative industry that is dominated by women.) So three of us guys got together and decided that we should just start our own company, changing the traditional business model slightly, replacing a lot of data entry work with better technology and some outsourced international labor.
We worked for most of the first year for nothing and are now in a position to hire people across the US. We have a pretty standard deal. If you bring some business on board with you, we will pay you 30% of the gross profit on that business until it gets to a salary level we agree upon. Thereafter, we pay that salary plus a smaller percentage of the GP on the business you brought (and on the business we give you).
Here’s our experience. Women, who dominate our industry, will not take that deal. Most of the women we interview have business relationships, but they expect us to exploit them prior to their doing the related work. Men, on the other hand, generally have fewer business relationships in place, but will work to close the deals in the hope that they will get a predictable salary (almost all do).
Our impression is that the women we interview have an advantage over men, but refuse to exploit it. It appears to us that they want something for nothing, whereas the men are generally working on the come to make an opportunity work for them.
Obviously this is all anecdotal evidence from a statistically irrelevant sample set, but by now, we are never surprised when women do not take our deal. We expect them not to. On the other hand, we expect that most men will have success in our business.
Not sure what all this means. Just thought I’d mention it.
Comment by Jake — March 10, 2010 @ 7:26 pm
People make all kinds of situations work. I have never felt it was the employer’s obligation to work around the lives of the employees, but that it was sometimes the smart thing to do. Don’t want to lose a great talent? Work around their schedule.
The sad thing as a former Silicone Valley resident is that I saw a lot of folks who were told they could do it all, then found out after they had a baby that is just doesn’t work. The problem was that they had financial burdens that called for two incomes. These were the parents who would agonize as they picked their kid up at day care after a 9 hour stay. The ones who decided to leave our high cost enclave seemed to be relieved.
Comment by dennymack — March 10, 2010 @ 7:32 pm
The interesting thing about all this to most guys? yeah, we don’t get a choice. When we are old enough to work, we work till we get close to dying. There are no choices involved. [There are a small group that manage to game the system, and most guys hate them...]
From a business perspective, what is craved is SURETY in the workforce. The potential that a person will call off, because one of their children is sick, creates chaos to them. THIS is why flexibility is an issue. Flex can be OK if nothing is deadline driven, but… In the interest of maximizing and just-in-time, everything is schedule driven and in Project for major milestones.
So, businesses pay a premium for allowing the chaotic flex, and the worker is the one that pays the difference.
Flextime ISN’T a problem if it’s the same every day, but with kids it often isn’t.
There are business cases for all this stuff, but in the interest of political correctness, everybody acts like it shouldn’t be so.
Oddly when a female boss needs extra work done to cover for someone who just left to pick up the kids, as they do everyday at the same time, who do they look to?
The divorced guy who “doesn’t have responsibilities”? Hmmm, yeah, I just get to pay for it all.
Comment by D — March 10, 2010 @ 7:34 pm
It’s not bring your problems to work day. It’s just work day.
Comment by Richard K. Jones — March 10, 2010 @ 7:42 pm
“Interesting take, but as a working woman with a flexible schedule and a 6 month old at home, I completely disagree that flexible schedules mean less productivity.”
The guys in your office doing your job would disagree.
Comment by nah — March 10, 2010 @ 8:58 pm
Nothing sexier than a woman who thinks for herself. And if she wants to take care of the home, even sexier still.
Comment by Keith — March 10, 2010 @ 9:24 pm
So based on one online survey we learn that women care less about work after having a baby. What about men? Do they care the same about the work after having a baby. Don’t men have children too, or only women do? Where men asked the same questions?
I think that in our days all the feminist talk is redundant regardless what side of politics it comes from. It mostly generates a large amount of pure bitchiness and is rarely constructive. I doubt there are many men or women that would not agree that women should have opportunity for developing carrers, as men do. However, the notion that men have to have the same opportunity to care for their children as women have is not voiced as loudly and frequently.
Men can be as wonderful parents as women are. Children certainly benefit from having both parents around, and even more so when both parents have happy and fulfulling lives. Women and men should have the same privileges in child rearing as women have, i.e. flex time etc, so each family can decide for themselves who has carrer and when.
Comment by norar — March 10, 2010 @ 9:31 pm
Just this morning I read blogger Anna’s commentary on a recent article in Forbes by Christina Hoff Sommers: http://tangotraining.com/blog/2010/03/09/
“I hope that we continue to work together to find ways that women can be as successful in their careers as men without giving up personal goals.”
Good luck with that.
Comment by Nate Whilk — March 10, 2010 @ 9:53 pm
oh come on.. how many people of either gender ‘care’ about their jobs other than fearing the possible loss of their income/benefits ?
and besides.. sarah palin is a living example (among many others) that a woman can, indeed, ‘have it all’. it ain’t easy, but it can be done.
whining about ‘choices’ and ‘compromises’ is a cop-out. we all make choices and are, sometimes, forced to make compromises. grow up, girls.
Comment by el polacko — March 10, 2010 @ 11:03 pm
Its not just the divorced guys who get stuck with the moms work, be a woman with no kids and unmarried. Same thing, you pick up all the slack.
Kids are the get out of jail free card
sorry I was late, had to bring kid to school
sorry, gotta take a long lunch bringing a kid to the dr
hey, gonna cut out early, its halloween and gotta get the kid into her costume
hey those 15 personal calls a day aren’t a bother, its just my kids asking this and that and this and that
and don’t even get me started on having two women pregnant in the same office at once….OMFG….I don;t care about your ultrasound and your kankles or then when they are born and they compare spit up and gaga’s for four hours across the cubicles
I go out to the warehouse to hear testosterone stories just to clear my head
Comment by Penny — March 10, 2010 @ 11:35 pm
It mostly generates a large amount of pure bitchiness and is rarely constructive.
They don’t see men as fully human. Men are just a resource to be pillaged, nothing more.
If you doubt this, probe a feminist on all sorts of issues regarding the basic human rights of men. You may not like what you find..
Comment by Toads — March 10, 2010 @ 11:53 pm
OK, I gotta nit pick over your teaser line. Dirty Mary went around with Crazy Larry. And Eastwood’s Jose Wales spoke the line, “A man’s gotta know his limitations.” It didn’t come from Dirty Harry who you tried to tie in to the Dirty Mary bit.
Just sayin’
Comment by MJBrutus — March 11, 2010 @ 7:43 am
Uh…..MJBrutus…..
“A Man’s Got to Know His Limitations” - Dirty Harry, Magnum Force
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2JnCXvm_Qc
Youbtube is a force for good.
Comment by Richard Cook — March 11, 2010 @ 9:45 am
One of the things I try to do is speak frankly with my daughters (high school age) about the emotional struggles between career and motherhood. I want them to recognize the obstacles they will face as well as think through how they might want to handle career, parenting and finances. These talks might all come to nothing, but having the conversations means they *ought* to better understand their choices and decisions. Also in years to come, I can say, “I-told-you-so” if they dare complain. Sweet.
Comment by Mary — March 11, 2010 @ 6:19 pm
[...] want to throw a shoutout to Instapundit for the ‘lanche this week on my post about women in the workplace, and a special thanks to Basil for bringing the post to Glenn’s [...]
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